Scary Guy, Big Heart

I came across a comment this morning on my previous thread Bullying so bad bullied students turn to guns

The comment came Gary Lee who is Director Of Operations Worldwide for The Scary Guy. Gary writes

John

I have seen the You Tube video a few times now and I cry too, which is why I wish to offer you and all the people here who share your view information about a remarkable individual that I GUARANTEE will make both an INSTANT & LIFE LONG impact on the youngsters (and adults) of Australia.

Feel free to contact me at any time.
Gary
garylee@thescaryguy.com

The video Gary refers to:

So who the hell is the scary guy and what is he about?  Take a look

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88 Responses

  1. Seriously, how on earth can crap like this happen and over such trivial stuff.

    School lockdown after machete-wielding youths invade
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25129034-5001021,00.html
    A PLAYGROUND fight over a girl led to yesterday’s rampage by axe-wielding teenagers through one of Sydney’s leading high schools.

    Students fled in terror and two female tuck shop workers ran for safety as three youths armed with machetes and a tomahawk allegedly terrorised the school.

    The youths were allegedly yelling out the name of a student as they made their way through the school.”

  2. Yes John, it is amazing what happens in our schools these days. Following the incident at Kingsgrove a few years back which saw more mayhem and violence you’d think the education department would develop a policy to combat violence. The education department seems to have a policy for everything else.

  3. And why do I feel that these ‘rampaging’ teenagers will turn out to be from the same ethnic groups that have been involved in past similar incidents in Sydney?

  4. Stephan

    Some things never change Stephan, in fact, they seem to get worse. This is really sad.

    Our kids in worst class of bullies

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/our-kids-in-worst-class-of-bullies/2008/12/13/1228585181498.html
    BULLYING in Australian primary schools is in the worst category in the world, a new study of education standards has found.

    In the Trends In International Mathematics And Science Study, which surveyed schools in about 40 countries, more than a quarter of Australian year 4 students said they had suffered bullying.

    The results have alarmed child-health experts and education bodies, which have been running strict anti-bullying programs in schools over the past six years.

    Australian primary school students suffer bullying at a rate of almost 50 per cent above the international average, putting Australia in the worst category for bullying. Of the 36 countries sampled in the survey of year 4 students, only Kuwait, Qatar, Taiwan and New Zealand fared worse than Australia.

    The research, which showed Australia lagging behind its neighbours and even Kazakhstan in maths and science education, found more than a quarter of Australian year 4 students had been bullied in at least three ways in the month before they were tested. The study was produced by the International Association for the Evaluation of Educational Achievement. Students were asked whether they had experienced any of five antisocial behaviours in the past month: whether something of theirs had been stolen, whether they had been hurt by other students, whether they had been made to do things against their will, whether they had been teased and whether they had been excluded by others.

    In Australia, where almost 460 schools took part in the study, 26percent of year 4 students had encountered at least three of the behaviours in the month in question.

    Internationally, 42 per cent of primary students said they had experienced none of the behaviours. In Australia it was less than 33 per cent.”

  5. Sans Blog, on March 3rd, 2009 at 11:17 am Said:

    And why do I feel that these ‘rampaging’ teenagers will turn out to be from the same ethnic groups that have been involved in past similar incidents in Sydney?

    Have you been thinking about the recent release of a movie depicting gang violence among Lebanese youth? I know I have and the message it sends to kids in that particular ethnic group.

  6. This is the movie I had in mind.

    Greater Union reopens The Combination
    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25131902-2702,00.html
    GREATER Union Cinemas has decided today to continue screening the Lebanese Australian gang film, The Combination.

    The decision to suspend sessions from cinemas in NSW was based on two incidents at Greater Union cinemas during the film’s opening week.

    The cinema chain says one of its security guards was hospitalised and a staff member was injured in a brawl that broke out in cinema.

    Police have not laid charges.

  7. John,

    Lebanese or Pacific Islander kids seem to be the ones most often involved.

    And the south western suburbs of Sydney seem to be turning into a no-go area. I noticed it so often that I started make a note whenever a serious crime is mentioned in the news (tv or print) and those sw suburbs appear to account for 80-90% of media-reported crime instances.

    I hope that movie is just not glorifying Lebanese youth gangs because that’s the last thing we need in Sydney.

  8. Sans

    “I hope that movie is just not glorifying Lebanese youth gangs because that’s the last thing we need in Sydney.”

    From what I can gather so far it seems to be. I’d need to see it for myself though.

    Yes, Islander kids also seem feature in a lot of the trouble in the south western suburbs of Sydney also

  9. However, John and Sans a question might be whether this is an ethnic issue or a lower socio-economic issue. Twenty years ago it was gangs of Italian and gangs of Vietnamese youths that made the headlines.

  10. Min

    Many of the Lebanese people in the mature age bracket I’ve come across have it pretty good and they’re hard workers. From what I’ve been told many of the kids feel that gang culture along ethnic lines has a strong appeal.

    Similarly with previous ethnic groups engaged in gang behaviour.

  11. I don’t think those gangs have gone away, Min. A lot of youth violence in Sydney involves youth gangs of different ethnicity. I have several friends in the police who confirm that this is the case.

    And it’s not just ‘foreign’ ethnic youths.

    My young son, coming home from Thursday night shopping, was beaten on Penrith Station with broken beer bottles by Aboriginal youths using anti-white racial taunts. The attending police officer told me they knew who the youths were but could not touch them as the local police command is trying to play down the problem of Aboriginal youth gangs in the area (and also in Katoomba now).

    And of course there are the white yobbos like those in Sutherland Shire (the Cronulla area for example).

  12. And at other times heat plays a major part in mob violence. Interesting theory. Soccer is traditionally a winter sport yet we see soccer hooliganism in some parts of Europe. Does anyone know how hot the sun is on one of those overcast English days? Can we expect to see Bondi lifesavers turning violent in late December early January because of exposure to hot weather? Any reports of violence at the BHP foundry? Is masturbation now out of control within police ranks?

    >Police say a violent brawl involving more than 100 people in a Sydney housing estate was an isolated incident, probably caused by too much sun and alcohol.<

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/06/2459904.htm

  13. Agreed John..very similar to the Vietnamese in Melbourne. These youths stand out as ‘different’ which therefore can be an encouragement to a gang culture. This same ‘difference’ is also an encouragement for those of other cultures (including Australians) to form gangs. A chicken versus egg thing in my opinion, do the ethnics form gangs in order to counter the, for example Anti-Leb gangs?

    I think that I mentioned previously but youngest, daughter E was subjected to racist taunts including being spat upon at a bus stop in Brisbane by white youths who thought that she was an ethnic (hubby is 1/2 Italian, family arrived Australia 1906)…because she was wearing a scarf that a friend gave her and had been to the dentist and it was a cold day.

  14. Sans..and so both your son and my daughter have been subjected to gang/racist violence. I agree very much about, It won’t go away..for example, prior to racist gang violence there was still gang violence – examples, Rockers Versus Mods and Mods Versus Sharpies.

  15. Min, on March 3rd, 2009 at 2:31 pm Said:

    So much for multiculturalism Min. The level of hate and anger between these groups and society seem only to be getting worse.

    I don’t know whether you’ve seen Clint Eastwood in Gran Tarino, but that gives a very powerful example gangs and the pressure that often put on their peers to belong. In this case it was a Korean gang. Same principles apply.

    Gran Torino – Official Trailer

  16. Rockers Versus Mods and Mods Versus Sharpies.

    I had forgotten about those, Min. As a member of a surf club (for 27 years), I would have been classed as ‘clubbie’ in those days – didn’t ride a surfboard so I couldn’t be surfie.

  17. Exactly John..re Same principles apply. That gang could just as easily have been white as Korean, yet the makers of the film chose a particular ethnic group.

    I personally have great faith in Australia. I’ve seen it all come and go – firstly it was the Italians who couldn’t assimilate as they could’na speak’a da’ language (they were however Catholic and so this was a plus) – then it was the Greeks who would never assimilate because they were a different sort of Christian and they sent their kids to Greek school – then it was the Vietnamese who would never assimilate because they looked different and weren’t even any sort of Christian.

  18. Min

    The outcome of this inquiry this month shall be interesting. Many of these gangs have members who are of school age and the increase in violence within recent years have involved gangs.

    Taunts turn to violence – bullying exposed
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,,25070761-5001021,00.html
    By Bruce McDougall

    February 18, 2009 12:00am

    BULLYING victims will be invited to tell their harrowing stories to a Parliamentary inquiry which has begun taking evidence.

    Since launching an anti-bullying campaign this week The Daily Telegraph has been inundated with complaints that schools and workplaces have failed to take action against the perpetrators.

    On Monday, The Daily Telegraph revealed school students were being severely bullied at a rate of more than eight a week, pushing some victims to threaten to shoot their tormentors.

    The family of one teenage male student told how their son was subjected to a series of assaults at an elite Sydney private college, which included:

    * A BROKEN arm sustained in an altercation with another student;

    * A KING hit from another student leaving him with a bruised neck and cheekbone; and

    * HARASSMENT by five students who called him an “emo” and told him to cut his own throat and wrists.

    State Parliamentary inquiry chairwoman, Coalition MP Robyn Parker said yesterday written submissions on bullying issues were being received and public hearings would be held from late next month.

  19. John. As a former teacher, I don’t have much faith in the education system. For how many years and years have children been bullied, for how many years and years have parents been fronting up to the Principal’s office.

    An anti-bullying strategy was introduced into Victorian school at least 15 years ago. Has this made a difference? No of course not because the root base cause is that teachers do not treat bullying as a serious issue. Tell the yard duty teacher and response more often than not is, Deal With It, don’t bother me.

  20. I’ve often wondered how long before we suffer a US style school massacre when a kid snaps and has access to firearms. There’s ample evidence to suggest that those who do snap are likely to have been the victim of bullying.

    Miranda Devine makes a good argument

    Beyond the finger on the trigger
    Miranda Devine
    April 26, 2007
    http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/beyond-the-finger-on-the-trigger/2007/04/25/1177459786890.html

    This is not a column excusing the Virginia Tech killer Cho Seung-hui. But it is important to understand that what drove Cho to murder 32 people on his university campus last week is what has driven so many other school mass killers in the United States and beyond: severe bullying at school.

    “There is a lot of evidence that he was badly bullied at school, especially through ridicule and exclusion,” an expert on bullying, Professor Ken Rigby, of the University of South Australia, said yesterday. “This almost certainly increased his sense of alienation and desire to strike back.”

    As distasteful as it is to watch the video Cho, 23, left behind, the words explain what motivated him: a desire for revenge against the students who had treated him as a non-person all his life.

    “Do you know what it feels like to be stood on your face and have trash shoved down your throat? … Do you know what it feels like to be humiliated and be impaled upon on a cross and left to bleed to death for your amusement? – You have never felt a single ounce of pain in your whole life. Yet you want to inject as much misery in our lives as you can, just because you can. You’ve had everything you wanted. Your Mercedes wasn’t enough, you brats … You sadistic snobs … You thought it was one pathetic boy’s life you were extinguishing …”

    Cho was bullied at school – like the Port Arthur killer Martin Bryant, and the Columbine school killers Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold and others analysed in a 2002 US Secret Service report on school attacks.

    The report found 71 per cent of killers “felt bullied, persecuted or injured by others prior to the attack. In one case, most of the attacker’s schoolmates described the attacker as the kid everyone teased … nearly every child in the school had at some point thrown [him] against a locker, tripped him in the hall, held his head under water in the pool or thrown things at him.”

    The bullying experienced by some school attackers was so serious that if it “occurred in the workplace, [it] likely would meet legal definitions of harassment and/or assault”.

  21. Min, on March 3rd, 2009 at 4:24 pm Said:

    John. As a former teacher, I don’t have much faith in the education system.”

    I hear you MIn. I’ve heard exactly the same coming from so many teachers and others involved in education.

  22. A double note John. A child who has had his arm broken, more than likely the school principal would be denying everything thinking litigation.

  23. My daughter was the victim of a school bully when she was around 8 or 9. There were a few days when she came home crying so I thought it necessary to speak to her teacher.

    The school’s action was to get the offender also 8 or 9 to sign a contract to say he wouldn’t do it again.

    If it hadn’t been a serious thing for my daughter I would have burst out laughing at such a silly solution for young kids. I wonder at what point in the primary school curriculum they covered the theory and application of contracts.

  24. And a problem also Sans is that if a child dobs, then they could cop worse.

    I personally think that the solution especially in the primary school years is to take the bully away from the class – expel them if necessary. At present the emphasis is on the victim..taking them out of the class and making a spectacle of them for being ‘weak’ and a dobber.

  25. Min, on March 3rd, 2009 at 4:32 pm Said:

    A double note John. A child who has had his arm broken, more than likely the school principal would be denying everything thinking litigation.”

    Exactly…deny liability…deny liability…deny liability

    Sans

    “The school’s action was to get the offender also 8 or 9 to sign a contract to say he wouldn’t do it again.”

    Did the trouble stop? It’s a bit of a band aid solution for sure though.

  26. Here’s a workplace bullying case that almost beggars belief

    Men forced to work with broken hands, arms
    By Natalie Sikora
    Herald Sun
    June 18, 2008
    http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,23882350-1243,00.html

    TWO Chinese nationals working under Federal Government 457 visas were forced to work with broken hands and arms on unsafe equipment at a printing company in the Melbourne suburb of Campbellfield, a court heard yesterday.

    While recovering from work injuries, Zi Hong Fu and Cheng Cai were given jobs that still required them to use both hands, including working on their boss’s home erecting steel beams while their hands were in plaster, the court was told.

    Just weeks after breaking a wrist falling off a ladder while performing unqualified electrical work, Mr Fu had to erect scaffolding on the unrailed factory roof, despite never having done it before.

    Broadmeadows Magistrates’ Court heard that while drilling into 8mm thick metal plates with his unbroken left hand using a two-handed drill – supported between his chin and right hand – he ended up breaking that wrist too.

    Ten days later he was told to come back to work at Lakeside Packaging to disassemble a machine while his left arm was still encased in plaster.

    He was given a letter at the end of the day warning him of his job performance. Mr Fu, 50, was in so much pain he returned to hospital, where doctors gave him another three weeks of sick leave.

  27. “Min, on March 3rd, 2009 at 5:00 pm Said:

    And a problem also Sans is that if a child dobs, then they could cop worse.

    I personally think that the solution especially in the primary school years is to take the bully away from the class – expel them if necessary. At present the emphasis is on the victim..taking them out of the class and making a spectacle of them for being ‘weak’ and a dobber.”

    I think kids realise that the system doesn’t really care and they’re essentially on their own. They figure it’s much easier to keep quiet and bottle it up rather than to reach out for help.

    I know, however, that our local High School have become quite adept at dealing with bullies since the new principal arrived. I gotten to know him quite well and he’s of the opinion that there has to be a commitment from top to bottom to take bullying seriously as well as be willing to expel and/or involve the police if necessary.

  28. Thankfully the offending kid was taken out the school by her mother (I mistakenly said ‘he’ above) a couple of weeks later for another reason.

  29. Actually now my daughter’s in high school, I have to say I find the psychological bullying of girls among themselves astonishing and sickening.

    Boys generally have a bit of rough and tumble for a few minutes or an hour or two then they’re best mates again whereas the girls appear to carrying it on for weeks and months.

    Women I’ve spoken to about it smile and say it’s the reason why women are generally psychologically tougher than males: the psych torture they went through at school toughened them.

    I don’t see anything to smile or boast about.

  30. Sans

    “Women I’ve spoken to about it smile and say it’s the reason why women are generally psychologically tougher than males: the psych torture they went through at school toughened them.

    I don’t see anything to smile or boast about.”

    I agree Sans, there’s nothing to smile about.

    Also, it’s not hard to find cases where the teacher’s simply turn a blind eye to the problem.

    Schoolgirl’s diary reveals campaign of bullying harassment
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24517114-5006009,00.html
    MOST girls use their diaries to record their latest crush, but Gabriela Plaza’s journal became a bully book, detailing a systematic campaign of harassment that left her feeling suicidal.

    And the 13-year-old has a simple message for Education Minister Verity Firth: work harder to stamp out bullying.

    Gabriela was reduced to tears daily and threatened suicide.

    She said that even though she recorded details of the attacks in a journal, teachers ignored her torment. The harassment ended in fellow students trying to throw her off a second-floor balcony.

    She was eventually forced to leave St Andrew’s College, Marayong, this month.

    A copy of her bully book – supplied to The Sunday Telegraph by her mother – reveals a systematic campaign of almost daily harassment.

    “He was choking me really badly . . . trying to kill me,” Gabriela wrote, of one attack. “He said: ‘You bitch, why don’t you kill yourself? You’re anorexic, go back where you came from’.”

    Another entry details an attack that Gabriela says was ignored by teachers.

    “He came up to me and almost punched me in the face. He came up really close, but I moved back,” she wrote. “He started pushing me . . . and punching and slapping me.”

  31. Sans and Min

    There’s also ample evidence to suggest that much more goes on in schools than is let on by the Education Department or the Education Minister. And the most recent rampage is most certainly not the first.

    Guns, knives found in schools
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,24520299-5001021,00.html
    Exclusive by Kelvin Bissett and Bruce McDougall

    October 20, 2008 12:00am

    PUBLIC school students were admitted to hospital with stabbing injuries on at least three occasions last year, as secret documents show that knives, tomahawks, laser pointers and replica guns are being regularly found in playgrounds.

    Official reports show that knives were found on students on 57 occasions, including three flick knives, and tomahawks on another four times last year.

    The Daily Telegraph can reveal the extent of the confiscated weapons cache in government schools as a gang of youths await sentencing today over a rampage involving a machete and samurai sword at Merrylands High in April.

  32. John, plus parents. Front up to the school principal and make a spectacle of your child, then your child will be labelled.

    There has to be an entire cultural change in schools where the bully is no longer perceived to be the hero and the victim is no longer perceived to be the dobber.

    And some sort of Anti-bullying policy isn’t going to make this happen.

  33. Surf gang violence – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRuVAQr5D70

  34. When son #2 was in primary school, he was dacked in public by another student, who no doubt thought he’d get away with it because of #2’s language disorder.

    When the principal found out about it, he dacked the little bugger in front of the assembled school and treated him and the school to a strong lecture about bullying and how it would not be tolerated. Problem solved.

    I know this is an extreme form of punishment, but sometimes I reckon it’s the only way. However, teachers have to be so careful these days, they can’t even verbally admonish a kid without fear of assault charges.

    I think the bullies have to be removed from school and have a restraining order slapped on them and their parents, no matter how young. If they ignore it, sterner measures should be taken and enforced. Don’t ask me what the sterner measures are, I haven’t got that far yet.

    Seriously, there’s been a very strong emphasis on understanding the bully, blah, blah on the grounds that they are probably being abused at home etc etc, but I have since read that the majority of bullies are not abused but are thugs and need to be metaphorically booted up the bum, instead of being handled with kid gloves.

  35. need to be metaphorically booted up the bum

    In the primary and high school I attended in the 50s and 60s (both private), the cane and detentions were liberally applied (the three hour Sat detention in full school uniform was mortifying).

    Now I don’t advocate a return to caning but it’s interesting to note that not one single peer of mine failed the NSW Leaving Certificate – it just wasn’t possible. Neither was failing to do homework, nor was talking back to teachers etc. etc.

    As for bullying, I was an out gay boy in high school and did not experience a single instance of homophobia/bullying – the opposite actually.

    The attrition rate of boys at my son’s high school (a Catholic one) between year 10 and 12 was enormous – they just kept dropping out over those two years and only one of my son’s group of friends actually sat for the NSW HSC.

    Does suspension do more harm than good? How do students who are suspended every catch their work up? This might be a punishment that suits schools/teachers but I suspect it’s detrimental to the student(s).

    Things have certainly changed in the education/school systems and definitely not for the better.

  36. Sans blog, if suspension wasn’t a holiday for the little mongrels, I reckon it might work. But it’s clear that bullying must not be tolerated under any circumstances and that means isolating the bullies from their victims and their cheer squads.

    I’m been very fortunate in that I’ve never been subject to bullying, so I can only imagine how soul destroying it must be. I do think that it’s still not regarded as a really serious problem and I reckon the bullies are still getting a free run.

    There needs to be a lot more education about the consequences of bullying and there has to be a genuine effort to squash it before it starts!

    Maybe the stocks and an ample supply of rotten fruit and stuff?

  37. Dear oh dear, how the ironies abound. But it’s comic relief on a grand scale. Let’s take John McPhilbin, on March 3rd, 2009 at 11:21 am and his link:

    The study found more than a quarter of Australian year 4 students (aged 8/9 years) had been ‘bullied. Really, only a quarter? Let’s look at the criteria used and remember it’s a newspaper report., I am surprised that the results don’t verge on 100%. And If not then why not?

    Let’s take the four criteria used.

    “whether something of theirs had been stolen, whether they had been hurt by other students, whether they had been made to do things against their will, whether they had been teased and whether they had been excluded by others”

    ‘Whether something has been stolen” Lol. Every 8 year old who has ‘lost’ something will claim it was ‘stolen’ if given the option on a response survey. The evidence re children of this age having a valid perspective suggests otherwise. At age 8, they are not ethical or moral. Those who asked such a question and hoped for a valid answer are off with the fairies.

    Then we have:

    “whether they had been hurt by other students”

    Again, the question is unbelievable. “Hurt by other students”? Hurt? If they play sport, then I suspect it happens on a daily basis. BTW, I didn’t write the question, I am only pointing out the stupidity of the report (assuming it’s accurate).

    As for:

    “whether they had been made to do things against their will,”

    You mean they were made to learn their tables when they didn’t want to? They were told to be quiet? To read? To be polite? Whatever! And this counts as ‘bullying’? Tis what schooling is all about. For example, the little ‘prick’ at the back of the room is constantly ‘been made to do things against their will’.

    On another thread it might be called ‘discipline’ and most would clap! Lol!

    Finally from this link, we have:

    “whether they had been teased and whether they had been excluded by others.”

    I’ll let the ‘teasing’ float for the moment but as for the ‘exclusion by others’. Of course it happens, it’s part of being socialised. It’s part of growing up. Even tonight, one grandchild was ‘excluded’ from the family group by his mother because he was misbehaving.

    Bullying my arse! At least. if this linked research is to be benchmark.

    I’ll limit my comments to but one link but there are numerous other comments that are also worthy of the same ridicule.

    For example ‘kick them out’ or ‘throw fruit at them’. and these are public policy position to confront ‘bullying’ -whateve that may mean.

    Is there a ‘conceptual defintion’ of bullying? Or maybe I missed that?

  38. I’m guessing you had a very sad childhood Nature5.

  39. John McPhilbin, on March 3rd, 2009 at 10:55 pm Said:
    I’m guessing you had a very sad childhood Nature5.

    No John. You have a monopoly on that! And other pseudo-intellectual insights.

    Want to address the points? Or is that too painful?

  40. I’m sure that specific questions were used to determine the frequency of bullying as opposed to the usual rough and tumble conflicts that occur as part of life.

    You may want to educate yourself Nature5 there is ample research for you to study without needing to ‘snipe at me’

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullying

    Bullying is the act of intentionally causing harm to others, through verbal harassment, physical assault, or other more subtle methods of coercion such as manipulation. Bullying can be defined in many different ways. Although the UK currently has no legal definition of bullying, [2] some US states have laws against it. Bullying is usually done to coerce others by fear or threat. [3]

    Bullying in school and the workplace is also referred to as peer abuse.

    In colloquial speech, bullying often describes a form of harassment perpetrated by an abuser who possesses more physical and/or social power and dominance than the victim. The victim of bullying is sometimes referred to as a target. The harassment can be verbal, physical and/or emotional. Sometimes bullies will pick on people bigger or smaller than their size. Bullies hurt people verbally and physically. There are many reasons for that. One of them is because the bullies themselves are or have been the victim of bullying[4][5][6] (e.g. a bullying child who is abused at home, or bullying adults who are abused by their colleagues).

    Many programs have been started to prevent bullying at schools with promotional speakers. Bullying consists of two types – verbal and physical.

    Norwegian researcher Dan Olweus defines bullying as when a person is “exposed, repeatedly and over time, to negative actions on the part of one or more other persons.” He defines negative action as “when a person intentionally inflicts injury or discomfort upon another person, through physical contact, through words or in other ways.”[7]

    Bullying can occur in any setting where human beings interact with each other. This includes school, church, the workplace, home and neighborhoods. It is even a common push factor in migration. Bullying can exist between social groups, social classes and even between countries (see Jingoism).

    Definition

    Bullying is an act of repeated aggressive behavior in order to intentionally hurt another person, physically or mentally. Bullying is characterized by an individual behaving in a certain way to gain power over another person (Besag, 1989). Behaviors may include name calling, verbal or written abuse, exclusion from activities, exclusion from social situations, physical abuse, or coercion (Carey, 2003; Whitted & Dupper, 2005). Bullies may behave this way to be perceived as popular or tough or to get attention. They may bully out of jealousy or be acting out because they themselves are bullied (Crothers & Levinson, 2004).

    USA National Center for Education Statistics suggests that bullying can be broken into two categories: Direct bullying, and indirect bullying which is also known as social aggression.[1]

    Ross states that direct bullying involves a great deal of physical aggression such as shoving and poking, throwing things, slapping, choking, punching and kicking, beating, stabbing, pulling hair, scratching, biting, scraping and pinching.[8]

    He also suggests that social aggression or indirect bullying is characterized by threatening the victim into social isolation. This isolation is achieved through a wide variety of techniques, including spreading gossip, refusing to socialize with the victim, bullying other people who wish to socialize with the victim, and criticizing the victim’s manner of dress and other socially-significant markers (including the victim’s race, religion, disability, etc). Ross (1998)[8] outlines other forms of indirect bullying which are more subtle and more likely to be verbal, such as name calling, the silent treatment, arguing others into submission, manipulation, gossip/ false gossip, lies, rumors/ false rumors, staring, giggling, laughing at the victim, saying certain words that trigger a reaction from a past event, and mocking. Children’s charity Act Against Bullying was set up in 2003 to help children who were victims of this type of bullying by researching and publishing coping skills.

    Effects

    The effects of bullying can be serious and even fatal. Mona O’Moore Ph. D of the Anti-Bullying Centre, Trinity College Dublin, said, “There is a growing body of research which indicates that individuals, whether child or adult who are persistently subjected to abusive behavior are at risk of stress related illness which can sometimes lead to suicide”.[9]

    Victims of bullying can suffer from long term emotional and behavioral problems. Bullying can cause loneliness, depression, anxiety, lead to low self-esteem and increased susceptibility to illness.[10]

    The National Conference of State Legislatures said:

    “In 2002, a report released by the U.S. Secret Service concluded that bullying played a significant role in many school shootings and that efforts should be made to eliminate bullying behavior.” [11]

    Characteristics of bullies

    Research indicates that adults who bully have personalities that are authoritarian, combined with a strong need to control or dominate.[12] It has also been suggested that a prejudicial view of subordinates can be particular a risk factor.[13]

    Further studies have shown that while envy and resentment may be motives for bullying,[14] there is little evidence to suggest that bullies suffer from any deficit in self esteem (as this would make it difficult to bully).[15] However, bullying can also be used as a tool to conceal shame or anxiety or to boost self esteem: by demeaning others, the abuser him/herself feels empowered[citation needed].

    Researchers have identified other risk factors such as quickness to anger and use of force, addiction to aggressive behaviors, mistaking others’ actions as hostile, concern with preserving self image, and engaging in obsessive or rigid actions.[16]

    Bullying may also be “tradition” in settings where an age group or higher rank feels superior than lowerclassmen, such as in the Russian Army where conscripts in their second year of service typically bully and control first year conscripts.[citation needed]

    It is often suggested that bullying behavior has its origin in childhood:

    “If aggressive behaviour is not challenged in childhood, there is a danger that it may become habitual. Indeed, there is research evidence, to indicate that bullying during childhood puts children at risk of criminal behaviour and domestic violence in adulthood.”[9]

    Bullying does not necessarily involve criminality or physical violence. For example, bullying often operates through psychological abuse or verbal abuse.

    Bullying can often be associated with street gangs, especially at school.

    History of bullying

    High-level forms of violence such as assault and murder usually receive most media attention, but lower-level forms of violence such as bullying, has only in recent years started to be addressed by researchers, parents and guardians and authority figures (Whitted & Dupper, 2005).

    It is only in recent years that bullying has been recognised and recorded as a separate and distinct offence, but there have been well documented cases that were recorded in a different context. The Fifth Volume of the Newgate Calendar [17] contains at least one example where Eton Scholars George Alexander Wood and Alexander Wellesley Leith were charged, at Aylesbury Assizes, with killing and slaying the Hon. F. Ashley Cooper on February 28, 1825 in an incident that would now, surely be described as “lethal hazing”[18]. The Newgate calendar contains several other examples that, while not as distinct, could be considered indicative of situations of bullying.

    Types of bullying

    School bullying

    Main article: School bullying

    In schools, bullying usually occurs in all areas of school. It can occur in nearly any part in or around the school building, though it more often occurs in PE, recess, hallways, bathrooms, on school buses and waiting for buses, classes that require group work and/or after school activities. Bullying in school sometimes consists of a group of students taking advantage of, or isolating one student in particular and gaining the loyalty of bystanders who want to avoid becoming the next victim. These bullies will taunt and tease their target before physically bullying the target. Targets of bullying in school are often pupils who are considered strange or different by their peers to begin with, making the situation harder for them to deal with. Some children bully because they have been isolated, and they have a deep need for belonging, but they do not possess the social skills to effectively keep friends (see social rejection).[10] “When you’re miserable, you need something more miserable than yourself.” This may explain the negative actions towards others that bullies exhibit.[citation needed] However, just like with adults, there are also those who simply enjoy hurting other people.

    Bullying can also be perpetrated by teachers and the school system itself: there is an inherent power differential in the system that can easily predispose to subtle or covert abuse, humiliation, or exclusion – even while maintaining overt commitments to anti-bullying policies.[19][20]

    School shootings are a bullying-related phenomenon that receive an enormous amount of media attention. An investigation undertaken by the United States Secret Service found that in over 2/3 of cases, attackers in school shooting incidents “felt persecuted, bullied, threatened, attacked, or injured by others prior to the incident”, and discredits the idea that school shooters are “loners” who “just snap”. Though observing that, “clearly, not every child who is bullied in school presents a risk for targeted violence in school”, the investigation report states that, “a number of attackers had experienced bullying and harassment that was longstanding and severe. In those cases, the experience of bullying appeared to play a major role in motivating the attack at school”. The report also observes “in a number of cases, attackers described experienced of being bullied in terms that approached torment”. The report concluded that, “(t)hat bullying played a major role in a number of these school shootings should strongly support ongoing efforts to combat bullying in American schools”.[21]

    Anti-bullying programs are designed to teach students cooperation, as well as training peer moderators in intervention and dispute resolution techniques, as a form of peer support.[citation needed]

    American victims and their families have legal recourse, such as suing a school or teacher for failure to adequately supervise, racial or gender discrimination, or other civil rights violations. Special education students who are victimized may sue a school or school board under the ADA or Section 504. In addition, the victims of some school shootings have sued both the shooters’ families and the schools.[22]

    Workplace bullying

    Main article: Workplace bullying

    According to the Workplace Bullying and Trauma Institute workplace bullying is “repeated, health-harming mistreatment, verbal abuse, or conduct which is threatening, humiliating, intimidating, or sabotage that interferes with work or some combination of the three.”[23]. Statistics show that bullying is 3 times as prevalent as illegal discrimination and at least 1,600 times as prevalent as workplace violence. Statistics also show that while only one employee in every 10,000 becomes a victim of workplace violence, one in six experiences bullying at work. Bullying is a little more common than sexual harassment but not verbal abuse which occurs more than bullying.

    Unlike the more physical form of school bullying, workplace bullying often takes place within the established rules and policies of the organization and society. Such actions are not necessarily illegal and may not even be against the firm’s regulations; however, the damage to the targeted employee and to workplace morale is obvious.

    Particularly when perpetrated by a group, workplace bullying is sometimes known as mobbing. It can also be known as “career assassination” in political circles.

    Cyberbullying

    Main article: Cyberbullying

    According to Canadian educator Bill Belsey, it:

    …involves the use of information and communication technologies such as e-mail, cell phone and pager text messages, instant messaging, defamatory personal Web sites, blogs, online games and defamatory online personal polling Web sites, to support deliberate, repeated, and hostile behaviour by an individual or group, that is intended to harm others.
    —Cyberbullying: An Emerging Threat to the Always On Generation[24]

    Bullies will even create blogs to intimidate victims worldwide.[25]

    Political bullying

    Main article: Jingoism

    Jingoism occurs when one country imposes its will on another. This is normally done with military force or threats. With threats, it is common to ensure that aid and grants will not be given to the smaller country or that the smaller country will not be allowed to join a trading organization. Often political corruptions, coup d’états, and kleptocracies are the solution and response to the countries being bullied.[citation needed]

    Military bullying

    In 2000, the UK Ministry of Defence (MOD) defined bullying as: “…the use of physical strength or the abuse of authority to intimidate or victimize others, or to give unlawful punishments.”[26] A review of a number of deaths by suicide at Princess Royal Barracks, Deepcut by Nicholas Blake QC indicated that whilst a culture of bullying existed during the mid to late 1990s many of the issues were being addressed as a result of the Defence Training Review.[27]

    Some argue that this behaviour should be allowed because of a general academic consensus that “soldiering” is different from other occupations. Soldiers expected to risk their lives should, according to them, develop strength of body and spirit to accept bullying.[28]

    In some countries, ritual hazing among recruits has been tolerated and even lauded as a rite of passage that builds character and toughness; while in others, systematic bullying of lower-ranking, young or physically slight recruits may in fact be encouraged by military policy, either tacitly or overtly (see dedovschina). Also, the Russian army usually have older/more experienced candidates abusing – kicking or punching – less experienced soldiers.[29].

    Hazing

    Main articles: Hazing and Ragging

    Hazing is an often ritualistic test which may constitute harassment, abuse, or humiliation with requirements to perform meaningless tasks; sometimes as a way of initiation into a social group. The term can refer to either physical (sometimes violent) or mental (possibly degrading) practices. It is a subjective matter where to draw to line between ‘normal’ hazing (somewhat abusive) and a mere rite of passage (essentially bonding; proponents may argue they can coincide), and there is a gray area where exactly the other side passes over into sheer degrading, even harmful abuse that should not even be tolerated if accepted voluntarily (serious but avoidable accidents do still happen; even deliberate abuse with similar grave medical consequences occurs, in some traditions even rather often). Furthermore, as it must be a ritual initiation, a different social context may mean a same treatment is technically hazing for some, not for others, e.g. a line-crossing ceremony when passing the equator at sea is hazing for the sailor while the extended (generally voluntary, more playful) application to passengers is not.

    Hazing has been reported in a variety of social contexts, including:

    * Sports teams
    * Academic fraternities and sororities (see fraternities and sororities)These practices are not limited to American schools. Swedish students undergo a similar bonding period, known as nollningen, in which all members of the entering class participate.
    * College and universities in general.
    * Associated groups, like fan clubs, school bands
    * Secret societies and even certain service clubs, or rather their local sections (such as some modern US Freemasons; not traditional masonic lodges)
    * Similarly various other competitive sports teams or clubs, even ‘soft’ and non-competitive ones (such as arts)
    * The armed forces — e.g., in the U.S., hard hazing practices from World War I boot camps were introduced into colleges. In Poland army hazing is called Polish fala “wave” adopted pre-World War I from non-Polish armies. In the Russian army (formerly the Red Army) hazing is called “Dedovshchina”.
    * Police forces (often with a paramilitary tradition)
    * Rescue services, such as lifeguards (also drilled for operations in military style)
    * In workplaces
    * Inmate hazing is also common at confinement facilities around the world, including frequent reports of beatings and sexual assaults by fellow inmates.

    Hazing is considered a felony in several US states, and anti-hazing legislation has been proposed in other states.

  41. Min, on March 3rd, 2009 at 5:54 pm Said:

    John, plus parents. Front up to the school principal and make a spectacle of your child, then your child will be labelled.

    There has to be an entire cultural change in schools where the bully is no longer perceived to be the hero and the victim is no longer perceived to be the dobber.

    And some sort of Anti-bullying policy isn’t going to make this happen.”

    Precisely Min.

  42. Nature5

    You’re embarrassing yourself.

  43. John McPhilbin, on March 3rd, 2009 at 11:05 pm Said:
    Nature5

    You’re embarrassing yourself.

    Really? Only perhaps in your mind John.

    As always John you cut and paste ‘historical’ posts and hope that will suffice in every case. Please respond to the specifics. Or is the link you provided an embarrassment?

  44. Nature5

    I think my answered your questions. This post is about bullying in general.

    My concern with you is that you’ve spent a hell of a lot of time and energy ‘sniping’ at me, which tells me you have a problem.

    You come across as someone who gets great joy out of feeling superior to others, yet, it’s that very same feeling that exposes your weakness. Underlying this drive, because you do tend to make things personal, (Dear oh dear, how the ironies abound. But it’s comic relief on a grand scale. Let’s take John McPhilbin, on March 3rd, 2009 at 11:21 am and his link:) seems to be a sense of deep seated inadequacy. It shows plainly in you tone.

    This isn’t my stuff Nature5, it’s yours, so please learn to try and deal with it. You’ll also note, as I’m sure many others have probably noticed it that you’ve, for some reason, targeted me as a object to vent your angst.

    Ironically, it’s the very same behaviour you’re displaying that can quite easily meet the criteria of what is considered bullying behaviour.

    If you insist on making things personal I’ll have to ask that Joni bars you from this site.

  45. Sans and Min, just in:

    Police look for gun at Combination screening and find machete
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25134029-5001021,00.html

    A MAN was spotted allegedly carrying a black handgun down the front of his trousers at a Sydney screening of the controversial new Australian film The Combination.

    Police were called to the Hoyts cinema at Stockland at Wetherill Park in Sydney’s West on Sunday to investigate.

    The release of the film has seen brawls break-out outside the Greater Union cinema in Parramatta led Greater Union cinemas to cancel the film. That decisision was revoked yesterday

    Police searched the man and couldn’t find the “gun” but they did find a machete while searching his car, the Fairfield Advance reports.

  46. John, I fail to see how linking to HYPED articles and fear-mongering is going to help. I find this thread over-the-top and some of the comments about the education system ignorant & passe.

    There are educators & counsellors out there everyday dealing effectively w/ bullying & abuse-related matters. Bringing up American massacres and comparing them to the occasional media HYPED incident is the height of irresponsibility.

    I see this thread as no more than an excuse for parents to panic & agree to introducing American style security systems into schools. A lotta good that has done. You worked in the “Security” area didn’t you John? Surely you don’t want that American piece of sh*t system introduced full-bore here?

    The more the corporate media & others FOCUS on the negatives…& incidents of violence the more it becomes a self-replicating reality.

    HEALING is going on across this country. Don’t RUIN it w/ HYPE & exaggeration that benefits the media moguls & corporate shareholders over children.

    And by gawd, if this kind of HYPE spreads and causes more violence…there will be HELL to PAY.

    Unfortunately, you sound more like a Murdoch type everyday John.

    Let’s start hearing some POSITIVES John.

    N’…disappointed.

  47. John said: “Some things never change Stephan, in fact, they seem to get worse.”

    See what I mean John?.
    N’

  48. N’
    There’s a reality that many people are not seeing N’ It seems we’re already on par with the US system. Even the teachers are under fire.

    National teacher-bullying crisis
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,22844878-5001021,00.html
    MORE than 90 per cent of teachers say they have been bullied by colleagues.

    The teachers also claim they have been exposed to unmanageable workloads and have been ignored, frozen out or excluded from decision making.

    The frightening picture of dysfunctional relationships and low morale in schools is exposed in a new national online survey – the first of its kind in Australia.

    More than 80 per cent of teachers say they have had their personal integrity undermined, responsibilities removed or added without consultation and have had concerns about unfair treatment, harassment and bullying dismissed.

    According to survey responses the bullies – in order – are school executive staff, colleagues, principals and parents.

    One in five teachers said they had had personal property attacked, such as their car or their office, and a similar number complain about physical abuse or threats of violence.

    Many teachers also claimed they had been subjected to insults about their political or religious convictions at school.

  49. N’

    “You worked in the “Security” area didn’t you John? Surely you don’t want that American piece of sh*t system introduced full-bore here?”

    And precisely the reason I’m concerned. We need to be much more pro-active than we are if we want to avoid becoming even more like the US.

  50. N’

    Take some time please to read some of the concerned comments from parents and educators from this Sydney Daily Telegraph Blog. Please don’t assume I haven’t done my homework on this issue.

    Bloggers against Bullies
    http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/yoursay/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/bloggers_against_bullies_your_strategies/
    Garth Montgomery
    Thursday, July 31, 2008

  51. I think Elizabeth Farrelly is close to the mark: We constantly Band-Aid bullying – in schools and workplaces, nursing homes and churches, government departments, ministerial offices and even in the army (uh, isn’t that what armies are for?) But in truth we now have a system based on bullying; run by bullies, for bullies. A system that not only rewards and promotes bullies, but covers up when they’re caught.

    Bullying and toxic favours provoke mood of disgust
    http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/elizabeth-farrelly/bullying-and-toxic-favours-provoke-mood-of-disgust/2008/11/05/1225560938155.html

    We laugh at Russia’s codependency on the ruling sociopath, and maybe even America’s. But are we really so different? Has Bush set the tone?

    We constantly Band-Aid bullying – in schools and workplaces, nursing homes and churches, government departments, ministerial offices and even in the army (uh, isn’t that what armies are for?) But in truth we now have a system based on bullying; run by bullies, for bullies. A system that not only rewards and promotes bullies, but covers up when they’re caught.

    We know this. We also know the state is coming apart at the seams. We no longer seem to be able to run trains on time, even on existing tracks, much less build them. We now have hospitals where people miscarry in toilets, where you go in for a check-up and come out with genital mutilation, where your doctor may be unqualified and your nurses must beg bandages from the local vet.

    We have a state where former premiers can translate Macquarie Street power into Macquarie Bank dollars with no one turning a hair. Where notorious developers say they’d rather deal with the stringent city council than the embarrassingly flexible State Government.

    Set in Third-World terms, it’s perfectly plain that these are the marks of a tin pot economy and that there is a direct causality between the cosiness, thuggery and crumbling of civilisation.

    But we also know that bullying runs in families. It is highly infectious, depends on and tends to be passed on vertically, so that the bullied bully. And although NSW has always had a mean, bullyboy streak, it has widened enormously during the Bush years.

    America, under Bush, bullied the world into Iraq. It guzzled its way out of Kyoto and into Katrina. It took us all into subprime and the crash. America was the bad sheriff, but Australia its willing deputy. We were Sarah Palin to Bush’s McCain. And although Obama’s chalice may be poisoned, even his holding it should incline our decision-makers a little more towards decency, and away from thuggery. Hope springs eternal, or at least until the train comes.”

  52. Here’s a positive N’ – Taking a united stand against this behaviour is the surest path of prevention.

    Town fights school thugs
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,,25075429-5001021,00.html

    A TOWN in which two bullied teenagers committed suicide is taking the fight to playground thugs in a bid to stamp out the deadly behaviour. Schoolboy victims Alex Wildman and Tim Winkler killed themselves seven years apart after bullying at Lismore on the North Coast.

    Victims across the state contacted The Daily Telegraph with stories of how their lives were made a misery by bullies, including one woman who was held over a stairwell by her ankles.

    State Nationals MP Thomas George has letterboxed homes in Lismore urging the community to unite to “stamp out bullying”.

    “The time to think about how we can eliminate bullying and act . . . is now,” Mr George wrote.

    “Bullying at school, in the workplace or at home is totally unacceptable and cannot be tolerated. We need to empower teachers and principals to discipline students, boost the number of school counsellors and get schools and police to work together.”

  53. Today N’

    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25135707-5001021,00.html
    By Gemma Jones

    March 04, 2009 12:00am

    CYBER bullying has grown so damaging it is driving some teenagers to suicide, young people have told the State Government.

    Teenagers subjected to humiliation in front of thousands of internet users were also increasingly becoming the subject of death threats.

    Threats and other internet bullying tactics were putting teenagers at greater risk of depression and anxiety than face-to-face bullying, experts said.

    The NSW Government formed an advisory panel of teenagers who have asked for drastic measures, including education classes for students and their parents and a phone helpline, to stop the growing problem.

    Caught in the crowd: Join the fight against bullying

    Of 65 teenagers who registered to use an online government forum, 25 had suffered cyber bullying on networking sites, in chat rooms and by email.

    In the most serious circumstances, online bullying can end in long-term mental health issues and suicide, the NSW Youth Advisory Council said.

    The size of the audience able to view or access the damaging material increases the humiliation, which is likely to increase the damaging impact.

    Youth Advisory Chair Amanda Scott, 21, said the group had learned of suicides as a result of cyber bullying.

    “It is like a constant form of persecution and people don’t know what to do,” she said. “We did know of a person who was being cyber bullied and they did commit suicide.”

    Professor Donna Cross is studying 22,000 cases. She said, while there had been suicides in which cyber bullying was a factor, help was available.

    “Suicide is an extreme outcome. A very small number of children who do commit suicide are being cyber bullied,” she said.

    The fact that cyber bullying can be used 24/7 makes it worse than face-to-face bullying, she added.

    Kids Helpline 1800 551 800

  54. N’

    Some common has bullying become, this is a typical case:

    “My 13 yo is going to Gloucester High School, and is absolutely miserable. He has spent his whole school life being bullied. The school claims to be trying to help, but he has threatened suicide, self harm, and has drawn violent pictures. He has NO friends, and no chance to make any as th bullies STALK him. He is an only child, a sweet boy who is very at home with adults, and can hold his own with Company Directors. WE ARE SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING MOVING HIM TO A PRIVATE SCHOOL. He is now telling me of cases where teachers ignore him in as class, due to my intervention at ths school when there are problems. When he retaliates against the bullies, he is punished by the school.

    WHAT THE F@@K DO I DO?????

    Millstoneridge of Belbora (Gloucester) (Reply)
    Fri 01 Aug 08 (12:09am) “

  55. N’

    To be fair, I’ve been researching and lobbying in this area for some time now.

  56. N’

    Here’s an OZ-first initiative

    Parents on internet bully patrol
    http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,25134569-662,00.html
    Emily Power
    March 04, 2009 12:00am

    POLICE-trained cyber squads are helping parents and teachers protect children from internet bullies, sex predators and identity frauds.

    Adults are taught to minimise the dangers by learning how children use technology.

    The Australian-first program, running in primary and secondary schools, covers grooming, cyber bullying, harassment, inappropriate content, identity theft and fraud.

    It also confronts the rising mobile phone phenomenon “sexting”, in which teens send naked shots of themselves via SMS.

    The ThinkUKnow program, which started last month, explains how social networking sites, instant messaging, online gaming and blogs work.

    It is the first time Australian law enforcement has teamed with industry to create an education program to tackle online dangers.

  57. N’

    One final thing I’m sure you can appreciate. We’ve discussed previously the reasons for leaving the education profession. My conclusion after that discussion was that you had all the right ideas along with passion yet you felt a pressure that became unbearable. The system and people within it were somewhat hostile or indifferent, correct me I’m wrong.

    This suggests to me that you were working in a toxic environment and the same type of environment that so often fosters and supports bullying behaviours.

  58. John said: “This suggests to me that you were working in a toxic environment and the same type of environment that so often fosters and supports bullying behaviours.”

    There are problems John…but don’t use my words to identify public education as “a toxic environment”. I told you about the positives that have occurred under Anna Bligh. You’re being a tricky dick John.

    And you tell me what the following quotes & tenor of this latest thread up to my 1st comment has to do w/ the enLIGHTened conversation previously ? (A thread I gave you credit for John…think about why I might be agro John?):

    “Yes, Islander kids also seem feature in a lot of the trouble in the south western suburbs of Sydney also”

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “Have you been thinking about the recent release of a movie depicting gang violence among Lebanese youth? I know I have and the message it sends to kids in that particular ethnic group.”

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “From what I’ve been told many of the kids feel that gang culture along ethnic lines has a strong appeal.

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “So much for multiculturalism Min. The level of hate and anger between these groups and society seem only to be getting worse.”

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “I’ve often wondered how long before we suffer a US style school massacre when a kid snaps and has access to firearms.

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “Miranda Devine makes a good argument”

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    “There’s a reality that many people are not seeing N’ It seems we’re already on par with the US system. Even the teachers are under fire.”

    Doesn’t help to HEAL.

    John, there is a DARKNESS continually stirring panic & fear in this Country…it’s the same that created fear-mongerer, Bill O’Reilly and Fox News.

    Don’t FEED it.

    From that thread you mentioned:

    What about the bullies w/ money to throw around?…& those bullies in the corporate media?
    N’

  59. N’

    So your answer to everything is ‘ignore it’ and it will go away?
    Frankly, I’m sick and tired of people burying their heads in the sand N’. Reality is, we’re failing these kids.

  60. N’

    Consider for a moment the fact that many adults truggle to deal with bullying in the workplace and then think of how hard it must be for kids. The psychological impact can be devastating. As an example:

    Bullied miner’s plan to sue
    CHRISTINE KELLETT
    http://mountisa.yourguide.com.au/news/local/news/general/bullied-miners-plan-to-sue/1449704.aspx
    A 46-year-old mine worker reverted to a childlike state and began calling his wife “mummy” after being threatened with sexual assault during two years of torment at the hands of workplace bullies, a court has heard.

    Alfons Nooteboom, now 50, plans to sue mining giant Xstrata over his treatment by colleagues and supervisors at the Ernest Henry copper and gold mine at Cloncurry, in NorthWest Queensland, where he worked as a truck driver from 2002 until suffering a breakdown in November 2004.

    The Industrial Magistrates Court last week found management failed to take proper action when Mr Nooteboom complained of harassment, abuse and “dangerous” practical jokes by his fellow workers, including deliberately overloading his truck.

    His lawyer, Rachel Gordon, said management even took part in the abuse by encouraging him to apply for training that he was not eligible for under mine policy.

    “They set him up for failure,” Ms Gordon said.

    “This is the worst case (of workplace bullying) I’ve ever seen. This man suffered a significant psychological injury. He lost his family, he lost the ability to function in day-to-day life. It’s doubtful he’ll ever be able to work again.”

    Ms Gordon said at the height of the bullying, a group of mine workers threatened to “take him out the back” and perform sex acts on her client, who reported the matter to his superiors.

    He later began to exhibit signs of anxiety and withdrew from his family.

    His former wife Lynette said Mr Nooteboom’s personality changed in the time he worked for Xstrata.

    “He lost all interest in family activities and instead just came home from work and went straight to bed,” Ms Nooteboom said.

    “Our two eldest children ended up leaving home to live elsewhere in the midst of their secondary studies because his behaviour became unbearable.”

    Mr Nooteboom lodged a WorkCover claim in November 2004 but it was rejected by workers compensation authority QComp on the grounds mine management had taken appropriate action to address the harassment at the time.

    He launched an appeal and successfully fought to have the decision overturned in the Industrial Magistrates Court in Brisbane on Friday.

    Ms Gordon said the ruling – that the action taken by Xstrata was not reasonable under the circumstances – meant Mr Nooteboom was entitled to workers’ compensation.

    It also opened the gates for him to sue the company. The amount he is seeking is still under consideration

  61. John, it seems that you and Nature 5 have a little history.

    Sometimes exchanges can become difficult, that’s often the nature of exchanging opinions.

    I generally find the input of Nature 5 pretty sharp, occasionally annoying. We need more comments from all points of view, even ones that annoy and bother us.

    Otherwise the site becomes bland, uninteresting. We eventually stop enjoying participating.

    I hope your suggestion of barring Nature 5 from the site is ignored. I’d don’t think this is an appropriate response by you at all.

  62. I see this thread as no more than an excuse for parents to panic & agree to introducing American style security systems into schools.

    Hopefully by discussing the situation we can avoid that, Nasking,

    I think you’d have to have your head in the sand to deny there is less effective discipline in schools today than there was in, say, the 50s, 60s and 70s. Since then we seem to experiment with our school kids through syllabi and methods of teaching. Probably too many PhDs in education gained with lack of practical teaching.

    My example above of getting an 8yo to sign a contract that they will not bully is an example of just what a ridiculous state we’ve reached.

    When I went to school in the 60s and 70s it was the schools’ and teachers’ that instilled many social values into students, simple things like manners. Now that teachers are ‘professionals’ that sort of thing is considered below them (teachers will never be professionals in my eyes until they act like them and show professional results across the board).

    There is a lot to be said for the ‘boot in the bum’ by the local copper and the ‘rap on the knuckles’ by a teacher. Many young people have no fear of punishment today because they know the law is not seen to be applied – witness the behaviour of P plate drivers and the decreasing visibility of the highway patrol at least in NSW – and when it is it’s often soft because the poor dears had a tough upbringing.

  63. Tom

    “I generally find the input of Nature 5 pretty sharp, occasionally annoying. We need more comments from all points of view, even ones that annoy and bother us.”

    References to my alleged parasitic-like behaviours as an example in a previous thread was almost the straw that broke the camel’s back Tom.

    I enjoy differences of opinions Tom, but when people start getting personal Tom I strongly object, and I make no apologies for that. Put quite simply, if it continues, I also o have an option and that is to leave and let Nature5 continue on.

    We’ve had our differences of opinion, and as you know Tom, we’re always civil even if we are passionate.

  64. Tom

    I should add that I did attempt to break the ice between us just recently Tom. And have acknowledged Nature5’s contributions and at no stage have I attempted to belittle.

  65. Sans Blog, on March 4th, 2009 at 9:33 am Said:

    I see this thread as no more than an excuse for parents to panic & agree to introducing American style security systems into schools.

    Hopefully by discussing the situation we can avoid that, Nasking,”

    Precisely Sans, which is exactly why I’m so passionate about the issue. It constantly gets brushed under the carpet and thrown into the ‘too hard basket’.

  66. John, there’s plenty of people here that completely ignore my annoying input.

    Good for them. They’ve decided that it’s not worth the bother.

    That’s fine, it doesn’t stop me from having my say though, and it probably causes them less annoyance and frustration. Perhaps it’s an approach worth considering with regard to Nature 5.

    As I pointed out earlier, I’d prefer see more of the old cronies here (with one possible exception) rather than less.

  67. Sadly, it’s a fact that many people naturally try to avoid unpleasant realities as well as conflict in general.

    In fact, it’s a sure thing that when people come across people in heated conflict in blogs many people tend to stay away for fear of getting caught in the cross-fire.

  68. John, I see participating in a blog as a bit like barracking at a game of football.

    We might be informed about the game, or we may not. We are usually the spectators rather than participants. Our exchanges may be passionate, bitter, disappointed, funny, sarcastic, but we’re only here because we choose to be barrackers on one side of an issue.

    I like to think that it is banter, I treat it as such. We shouldn’t take it all too seriously.

  69. Sans

    The recent rampage through a school here in OZ was triggered because a boy at the school had ditched a girl they knew. But have a look at this. It too almost defies belief.

    Two boys, each 13, accused of shooting brothers dead
    http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25136981-5001021,00.html
    A 13-year-old boy has been charged with fatally shooting his 10-year-old brother after an argument over where to sit to watch a movie, authorities in the US state of South Carolina say.

    The news comes less than 24 hours after it was revealed another US 13-year-old allegedly shot dead his brother to gain control of their drugs business – full story below.

    Kershaw County Sheriff’s Captain David Thomley said the film row teen shot his brother, Gayloyd Roberts, in the face on Monday.

    The teen was charged on Tuesday with murder.

    Thomley said the boys and an eight-year-old sibling were home alone with their 15-year-old sister because school had been cancelled due to the threat of snow.

    Authorities said the children’s father, Gary, had been charged with unlawful neglect because he left a loaded shotgun against a bedroom wall.

  70. All,

    I understand the passion – but can we play the ball and not the person please.

    joni in moderator mode

  71. Tom

    “I like to think that it is banter, I treat it as such. We shouldn’t take it all too seriously.”

    Rarely do I take offense and most people who know me would agree. But I know ‘sniping’ when I see it and frankly it’s something I don’t tolerate not in blogging or in face -to -face meetings. You try to ignore a sniper and it only makes them more determined to get your attention. Confront them and they realise the game’s up. I too see it as a game, but one I take more seriously than other games I play.

  72. “I understand the passion – but can we play the ball and not the person please.”

    Exactly, I can understand miscommunications happen and that in attempting to play the ball someone might inadvertently kick us in the shins. And yes, it can hurt. But kick someone in the shins and then pretend you’re playing the ball and it would piss anyone off – it adds insult to injury and isn’t necessary at all. Fouls like that need to be addressed up front.

    I’d like to think I’m one of the first to apologise if I’ve inadvertently kicked someone in the shins.

  73. “So your answer to everything is ‘ignore it’ and it will go away?”

    That’s a load of garbage John & you know it.

    Tell me how the comments I identified above are going to help prevent bullying John? They sound more divisive & stereotyping than anything else.

    How does feeding into a MORAL PANIC tsunami and linking to the Murdoch & Fairfax & other corporate media links help prevent bullying?

    I give you credit for being concerned about bullying in schools & other workplaces John…but promoting POLICE STATE tactics is not the way to go as far as I’m concerned.

    A local police officer who comes to the school, gets to know the students can help. But so does having enuff career & other counsellors, homework centres, full-time school nurse, anti-truancy officers, welfare officers, F/T Guidance officers, tutoring opportunities…the list goes on.

    But usually the pollies will cop out, the taxpayers won’t be convinced to do the right thing, and taking the BIG STICK “law & order uber alles” approach will win out…as it has across the world.

    And in the long run, the anti-bully ENFORCERS become the BULLIES…& the characters w/ shares in SECURITY companies & corporate media moguls smile to the sound of KERCHING!

    N’

  74. “I give you credit for being concerned about bullying in schools & other workplaces John…but promoting POLICE STATE tactics is not the way to go as far as I’m concerned.”

    When have I ever promoted police state tactics N’?

  75. Can I add? There are some practical responses to bullying. Firstly, I don’t believe that the reintroduction of the cane would help because as John notes, many bullies come from violent backgrounds. A caning can be worn as a badge of honor.

    I do not believe that suspending the child works. Many of these children belong to households where both parents work and so these children can be left for days to aimlessly wander the streets. Many of these children are under-achievers and so suspension just puts them at further disadvantage.

    It is my belief that education especially in the primary school years is far too female oriented (shoot me). Little boys are expected to act like little girls, expected to concentrate for extended periods of time with little physical activity.

    A solution therefore is to up the salaries for teachers so as to encourage more men into the profession who then provide role models for appropriate male behaviour, something often lacking in a bully’s background.

  76. And John…comparisons & predictions of certain massacres does not make spouses of educators disposed to dig certain threads either, if you get my drift.

    i’m going to leave it at that.

    No hard feelings.
    N’

  77. nasking, on March 4th, 2009 at 10:37 am Said:

    And John…comparisons & predictions of certain massacres does not make spouses of educators disposed to dig certain threads either, if you get my drift.

    i’m going to leave it at that.

    No hard feelings.
    N’

    I don’t follow N’ and you can be assured there are no hard feelings from my end. You like to play the ball hard at times and I respect that. That’s the way it should be.

    Cheers

  78. Min

    “A solution therefore is to up the salaries for teachers so as to encourage more men into the profession who then provide role models for appropriate male behaviour, something often lacking in a bully’s background.”

    I’ve heard this quite often and usually from female teachers. Boys and girls are different and boys do tend to be restless and many best express themselves through physical activity such as sports. More male role models in the form of teachers I think is a good idea.

  79. It is my belief that education especially in the primary school years is far too female oriented (shoot me). Little boys are expected to act like little girls, expected to concentrate for extended periods of time with little physical activity.

    Oh, Min, bless your heart: you’ve said what I wasn’t game enough to say (see how some of us are cowed by political correctness).

    My son never had a male teacher until year 7. All the principals at my children’s schools have been female as have the majority of teachers. In most instances when someone is interviewed on educational policies that person is a woman.

    Education, at least in NSW, is far too female-oriented and ‘little boys are expected to act like little girls’ hits the nail on the head’.

    I mentioned above how all my son’s friends drifted away from school between y10 and the HSC exam; I believe the main reason for this is that boys are not stimulated in school these days by the syllubus, and there is no way they are allowed to expel that male physical energy.

    I maybe old-fashioned but I believe, due to the different ways boys and girls develop, single-sex schools are the way to go as the first step in raising boys’ self-esteem and educational outcomes (I’m sure it was cost-cutting measures that caused their loss not a belief in some social cohesion policy wank).

  80. That’s our Min Sans (wink)

    “Oh, Min, bless your heart: you’ve said what I wasn’t game enough to say (see how some of us are cowed by political correctness)”

    She tells it as she sees it.

  81. Sans..plus minus male teachers, education and study can be seen as a girly thing.

  82. Sans..I disagree re same sex schools as I think that it’s good for both boys and girls to realise that the opposite sex are real live human beings.

    I think rather that respect should be given to how boys develop, for example a shorter concentration span and the need for additional physical activity (laps of the oval helps in my experience).

  83. I maybe old-fashioned but I believe, due to the different ways boys and girls develop, single-sex schools are the way to go as the first step in raising boys’ self-esteem and educational outcomes (I’m sure it was cost-cutting measures that caused their loss not a belief in some social cohesion policy wank…

    I just can’t agree with that thinking. Do we really need another generation of sexes not understanding each other? Do boys only get self esteem from other boys? Let’s face it, both sexes inhabit the world and they should not view the opposite sex as an alien life force. Girls and boys both bully so exclusivity won’t stop the behaviour. Are you saying that all bullying will cease because the other sex is removed from the equation?

    Bullying happens in exclusive all girls and all boys schools too, and bullying is not solely the behaviour of low-socio economic groups – many bullies come from privileged backgrounds, in fact, wealth, power and privilege must make for some fearless bullying.

  84. Kitty

    “Bullying happens in exclusive all girls and all boys schools too, and bullying is not solely the behaviour of low-socio economic groups – many bullies come from privileged backgrounds, in fact, wealth, power and privilege must make for some fearless bullying.”

    Absolutely, there have been some really disturbing cases as well.

  85. Kitty re Do boys only get self esteem from other boys? Ans: yes mostly.

    Absolutely Kitty and just to add a little, those in the upper socio economic groups tend to bully via subtle means rather than those that make the headlines in the newspapers.

    And this generally holds true for females as well from all socio economic backgrounds.

    It’s a very difficult situation, we can address bullying in males as their actions are mostly overt however how to address female bullying and males who are are perceived to be ‘nice boys’.

  86. I just think boys and girls have enough to worry about with getting through school without the pressure of romantic/broken relationships. I have just had enough of this with my teenage children. When a breakup occurs then friends of each form gangs which then do a bit of bullying. It’s very hard on girls when the ex-boyfriend’s friends go down the name-calling etc route in and out of the school grounds.

    That boys and girls mature at different ages is well recognised. There has been trialling in some schools where boys and girls are separated depending on the subject – together for maths and science, separate for English for example (this should be self-explanatory).

    There has also been some trialling (in Vic ?) of single sex schools and so far the results have been a positive.

    Here’s one link to ponder and there are plenty more on Google:

    Single-sex classrooms planned for Canberra

    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/local/news/general/singlesex-classrooms-planned-for-canberra/1425361.aspx

  87. Sans..this is going to happen whether or not the boys and the girls attend the same school. Just separating The Sinful Sexes (ref: The Goons) isn’t going to stop boys and girls having romances.

    Single sex schools have been around for decades and decades and there is no evidence (to my knowledge) that this benefits either boys or girls..nor have single sex schools stopped boys and girls from falling in love and having their hearts broken.

    Boys benefit from sharing classes with girls as it challenges them re English language and girls benefit from sharing classes with boys because it challenges them re Maths and Science.

    From your link: He hoped a trial would help close the ACT’s gender differences in maths and science, subjects in which girls tend to fall behind their male peers. Similarly, boys have poorer results in English.

  88. I’ll give you another reason why I despise corporate media run “moral panic” & “dob in someone” campaigns John such as this below:

    “Since launching an anti-bullying campaign this week The Daily Telegraph has been inundated with complaints that schools and workplaces have failed to take action against the perpetrators.”

    It’s too easy for the media to fake comments…and for individuals w/ a political &/or monetary agenda or personal VENDETTA to get heard.

    Think ASTROTURFING:

    The use of paid shills to create the impression of a popular movement, through means like letters to newspapers from soi-disant ‘concerned citizens’, paid opinion pieces, and the formation of grass-roots lobbying groups that are actually funded by a PR group (AstroTurf is fake grass; hence the term). See also sock puppet, tentacle.
    (cat b . org – jargon)

    I think Tony recently mentioned the term “sock puppet” on this blog.

    Furthermore, waves of unsubstantiated dob-ins can lead to dreadful results…I’m thinking of the McCarthy era, and even
    ABU GRAIB.

    And fighting for your REPUTATION & the reputation and rights of others against a government that has a huge military & rendition practices…

    and a corporate media that has BILLIONS at it’s disposal…

    becomes less “David against Goliath”.

    and more David vs an EMPIRE.
    N’

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